Rumblings abound on the Motu Proprio regarding the release of the Latin Mass. Ok, great. I'm all for it - except something bugs me. Many of us consider the "surroundings" important when we go to Mass. Considering all the parishes out there that aren't even remotely Catholic, what do you think they'd do if they got their hands on a Latin Mass. Can you imagine one at St. Sabina's in Chicago? Or anywhere in Orange County (Home of the Barney Mass)? Or how about St. Bernadette's in Severn, MD, which bills itself as "gay friendly"? I shudder to think of what they'd do to it.
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¡Ha, ha, ha! as hilarious as it is, it true. Now there will be another battle ground on inovations.
I am soooo sick of this argument. People, blasphemy is blasphemy is blasphemy. If the price of having daily TLM's to take my kids to is knowing that Fr. Bubbles down at St. Rose of Tatooine is gonna have a clown TLM, so be it. My kids are infinitely better off and he's still going to hell. Win win.
In the best of all possible worlds, juridical oversight by the Bishops would be ideal and would short-circuit these problems. However, in reality the Bishops are often the source of the clown liturgies. I think the faithful themselves will keep such things in check. Wealthier parishoners will get together and build their own Church along traditional lines which can then be consecrated and staffed by the FSSP, or whoever. Priests screwing around will be ignored.
Athanasius:
Why should only rich parishes get the Latin Mass? Honestly, Pope Benedict, who has often admitted that the New Mass is defective, needs to put his foot down and end all this crap: give every bishop two years to have the Tridentine Mass completely restored at all of their parishes, or face excommunication. After that happens, maybe then we could talk about allowing (not requiring) part of the Tridentine rite to be said in the vernacular, thereby retaining the undeniable benefits of a Mass we all understand while restoring the respect for Christ in the Blessed Sacrament that is at the core of this venerable rite.
Athanasius:
Why should only rich parishes get the Latin Mass? Honestly, it is time for Pope Benedict, a good man who has often lamented the defectiveness of the New Mass, to put his foot down and end all this crap. Give every bishop two years to have the Tridentine Mass restored in all of the parishes under their jurisdiction, or face excommunication. Once this is done, maybe we can talk about allowing (not requiring) the Tridentine rite to be said partially in the vernacular, thereby retaining the undeniable benefits of a Mass that all can understand while restoring the respect for Christ in the Blessed Sacrament that is at the core of this venerable rite.
Nothing will ever happen to reign these bad guys in until the Vatican drops it's "no discipline, just 'dialogue'" facade.
The Vatican started that avenue with John XXIII and have continued it even to today.
This works only with honest men, not with the gaggle of God-haters we have out there today.
The thing is, the God-haters (Mahony, Brown, et al) exploit the Mercy of the Vatican to further their own agenda.
It's just like being a parent - sometimes you just need to give out a spanking.
Orange county is currently home to two Latin Mass sites. See http://www.uvoc.org/ I have been to the one in the mission. It is rather nice and historic and appropriate. Although, you need to be there at least 1/2 ahead of time if you hope to find a seat.
I think the faithful themselves will keep such things in check. Wealthier parishoners will get together and build their own Church along traditional lines which can then be consecrated and staffed by the FSSP, or whoever. Priests screwing around will be ignored.
So then, why hasn't this been done up to now?
Anita,
I think the that the reason it hasn't happened is because - even today - those of us who consider these things important are still in the minority. I would bet that if you look at your average Novus Ordo mass attendees, most of them have only a scant awareness of all of these things we talk about.
But the Motu won't deal with the problem of these Bishops and Priests (and Cardinals) who hate anything traditional.
I can already hear what some of these will say "Great, we'll offer a TLM, but we need to "tweak" it a bit to meet the people "where they are", which is their classic cover for trashing anything and everything.
In many cases, the TLM will draw people "up" to it. In others, the hijackers will draw the TLM down to their own level of banality.
Paul, I think the TLM-hating bishops will either ignore the motu propio or, if it allows the bishop to deny permission to celebrate the TLM, they'll do that. I can imagine that being done in a diocese or two of my acquaintance.
IF YOU THINK MAHONEY WILL MAKE ANYTHING BUT THE USUAL TOKEN EFFORTS TO PROMOTE THE TRIDENTINE MASS AS "REQUIRED BY THE HOLY FATHER AND ROME" THINK AGAIN. MAHONEY AND A NUMBER OF LIKE MINDED REVISIONIST SUCH AS THE PRELATES IN THE U.K. & FRANCE ARE OF THE MINDSET THAT THEY WILL WAIT THIS POPE OUT "TILL HE DIE'S" IN THE HOPE OF ELECTING ANOTHER LIBERAL POPE LIKE PAUL 6TH (MONTINI). THIS DEFIANCE AND DISOBEDIENTS WOULD RESULT IN A LAY PERSONS EXCOMMUNICATION, SO IT BEGS THE QUESTION WHY ISN'T ROME LAISIZING (EXCOMMUNICATING) DISOBEDIENT BISHOPS LIKE MAHONEY, BROWN DANEEL, CASPER AND THE GANG OF 60'S REACTIONARIES IN GREAT BRITAIN, SCOTLAND AND WALES???????WITH THE COMING OF THE MOTU PROPRIO SUMMORUM PONTIFICUM AND THE FREEING OF THE LATIN MASS WHICH WAS NEVER OUTLAWED THE PANDORA'S BOX HAS BEEN OPENED AND IT IS CATHOLIC YOUTH PRODOMINATELY AND BY THE MILLIONS WORLDWIDE THAT ARE FILLING CHURCHES , MONASTERIES, ABBEYS AND SEMINARIES THAT OFFER THE CLASSIC MASS AND CATHOLIC CULTURE EXCLUSIVELY. THE NOVUS ORDO MISSAE OF PAUL THE 6TH WAS A DILUTING OF CATHOLIC-CHRISTIANITY AND PANDORING TO 16TH PROTESTANTS WITH THE HOPE OF REUNION,IT NEVER HAPPENED,IT NEVER WILL. PROTESTANT HERESY IS LOCKED INTO THE ERRORS OF SOLA SCRIPTURA AND ONCE SAVE ALWAYS SAVED NONESENSE AND OVER 20.000 PROTESTANT SECTS. IT IS "ROMAN" CATHOLICISM AND IT'S 1.5 BILLION ADHERENCE (AND GROWING FAST) AND EASTERN ORTHODOXY (SINCE THE FALL OF MARXIST LENINISM THAT ARE GROWING RAPIDLY WORLDWIDE AND WITH THE EXCEPT OF EVANGELICAL AND HOLY ROLLER PROTESTANTISM. PROTESTANTISM IN GENERAL IS ON THE DECLINE. I AM ONE PERSON THAT HAS RETURNED TO THE CHURCH SINCE THE RETURN OF THE LATIN MASS(AFTER WALKING AWAY 10 YRS AGO) AND MORE THAN A FEW FRIENDS HAVE SAID THEY WILL GIVE THE CHURCH ANOTHER TRY SINCE THE CLASSIC TRIDENTINE LITURGY HAS RETURNED (AND THOSE FRIENDS ARE PRESENTLY SITTING IN EVANGELICAL CHURCHES.
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